Prologue

Welcome to The Rankings Podcast where we feature top founders, entrepreneurs and elite personal injury attorneys and share their inspiring stories. Now let’s get started with the show.

Chris Dreyer

Chris Dreyer here CEO and Founder of Rankings.IO where we help elite personal injury attorneys dominate first page rankings. You’re listening to The Rankings Podcast where I feature top business owners, entrepreneurs, and elite personal injury attorneys. I am thrilled to welcome Joey Coleman to the show today Joey is the author of The Wall Street Journal best-selling book, Never Lose a Customer Again, a speaker teacher advisor Joey has more than 20 years of experience helping businesses convert their loyal customers into passionate fans. He is well-traveled having literally visited 48 countries on six continents. A true renaissance man, he is not only an award-winning speaker but also a lawyer, a writer, and even an artist. Joey, welcome to the show.

Joey Coleman

Oh, Chris, thank you so much. It’s an honor to be here. Thank you for that lovely introduction. It’s very kind of you. And I really appreciate everybody who’s tuning in to listen to our conversation. I’ve been looking forward to this for a while because I am such a fan of you and the work you do and your energy and your spirit and just who you are as a person. So really excited for this conversation.

Chris Dreyer

Joey, that’s, that’s so kind of you. So I really appreciate that. So let’s just jump right in. So for those who don’t know, what’s the kind of the 80/20 Overview The Pareto principle of the of the Never Lose a Customer Again, your book?

Joey Coleman

So I think I’d say the foundational principle behind it is we live in a world and in a society where a lot of focus is given towards acquiring clients. How do we market how do we sell? How do we fill the funnel, how we get people to be aware of who we are, how do we get them to sign on the dotted line and hire us. The reality is we don’t spend nearly as much time whether we’re business owners, or lawyers or accountants or you’ll fill in the blank, whatever your job is. Taking care of the people, after they become clients, we the amount of energy, the amount of money, the amount of focus we put into acquisition, compared to the amount of money and attention and focus and energy we put into retention is pretty desperate. And I think there’s a huge opportunity to focus on the experience we’re creating for our clients. Because when we do that, we eventually get to the point where we actually don’t have to market because our clients become our marketers, they become our sales force, they become the word in the marketplace, whether it’s word of mouth, or they’re actually giving testimonials that you know, are showing up on our webpages or in our marketing materials. It’s so much better when our clients sing our praises than when we sing our praises, that it really takes your business to a completely different place or your practice to a completely different place. What I’ll say for those that are a little more analytically minded, on the research shows that somewhere between 20 and 70% of new clients will decide to stop doing business with you before they reach the 100 day anniversary. And the reality is if on day 101 your clients are thrilled about the relationship, not only will the typical client stay with you for a very long time, the average is five years, but they will continue to refer business to you and want to be in relationship with you going forward. And I recognize that those statistics might sound a little odd to somebody in a personal injury environment where it’s like, no, they have their case, and we resolve their case. But in my experience as a practicing lawyer, and I worked on a handful of personal injury cases, probably more than a handful when I think about it. The big challenge is, in my experience, you go into the case with the right attitude, everybody’s on the same page, the lawyer is going to help them get a great settlement or a great verdict at trial, the client feels like they’re going to be able to get the money they need to care for their injury to replace the income they lost to try to get their life if at all possible back to what it was pre-injury or pre-accident. And yet all too often how the case ended. It didn’t end with those same feelings. And the reason it didn’t end with those same feelings is we either didn’t get them enough money or we got them a lot of money. But still, it didn’t get them back to what they thought they were going to be. And I think if you think about the experience and the care that you’re delivering as a lawyer and I know That’s maybe not common words to use. I think you can reconnect with why you got into the practice of law in the first place. I think a lot of lawyers, even elite personal injury lawyers have forgotten why they got into the practice in the first place. Because they’ve been so focused on growing their business and serving their clients and taking care of them. And that’s great. I’m not, I am I am far from one to cast aspersions on lawyers. Um, but the reality is, I think there’s a whole other level where a whole other gear that we can get that when we think about the experience,

Chris Dreyer

I think everything you said it is incredibly powerful. I know being an SEO guy myself, those that have the client experience, you make our job easier. Sure they turn into an advocate, and they leave a review. One of the things I didn’t even plan on asking you but but a set in a sense, is the client experience a referral flywheel? Is it what continues to power your heart 100% 100%?

Joey Coleman

And, and we we can look at it in the context of personal injury lawyers, we can look at it in the context of humanity. What do humans want? They want to be able to make the best possible choices? Where do they usually go to figure out the best possible choices? Well, the longer you’re on the planet, the more you realize, I’d love to just get to the right answer without having to go through all the wrong answers first, right? Like part of it is the stove is hot, right? I always joke with my boys got a seven year old and a four year old, no matter how many times I tell them that the stove is hot, until one of them full on burns the heck out of their hand, they’re not going to believe it. Now as their father, I don’t want them to feel pain, I don’t want them to have that experience, I tell them and thankfully, at this point in the game, neither of them has full on scalded their hand. But until they do, they won’t actually know that the stove is hot. I find that as I’ve gotten older, I’m much more interested in put leaving the stove is hot than needing to burn my hand to prove it. And as a result, when we think about word of mouth, I think what people are trying to do is find the solution, whether that’s a product or a service, that’s going to help them get what they want, without a bunch of Miss starts. And to your point, that’s where the referral engine becomes the flywheel. Because when your clients are out there singing your praises. People take that and really value that and appreciate it. And it’s kind of weird when you think about the context of personal injury referrals, right? Because it’s like, well, wait a second, how many people do we actually know who’ve been in a personal injury litigation type scenario that can then refer their lawyer to us. And the reality is, you only need to know one. Because if you know somebody who’s had an remarkable experience, and you find yourself in a personal injury scenario, and you ask for a referral to their lawyer, in my experience, the best personal injury lawyers in the world, though all the other really great personal injury lawyers who might be in your jurisdiction, they might not be able to personally help you, but they can get you to the right place. And then all boats rise together.

Chris Dreyer

I love that the rising tide lifts all boats. And that’s true. They all congregate together because they elevate each other. So I gotta ask you kind of a funny question that I’ve been curious about. So where did the idea to create Never Lose a Customer come from? What was it? Did you go to the dentist and he just had a horrible experience? Where decided, like, I have to write this book

Joey Coleman

on That’s funny. I love the reference the dentist. For those of you listening who haven’t read the book, I start off by telling a story of a remarkable experience I had with a dentist, which usually your dentist experiences remarkable for the wrong reasons. You’re remarking about the horrible experience where in this case, it was an incredible experience with my dentist, Dr. McCann. Um, the the genesis for the book actually came from a couple of things. As is often the case in life, there wasn’t a singular moment where I said, and now I need to write the book. It was a confluence of events, which actually describes most of my life that the confluence of events contribute to the reality that is today. A couple things briefly, and we can pull on any of these threads that you’re interested in. In. I was reading in the, in the 90s, some research that had been done in a business setting that talked about how many people left their bank in the first 100 days. And it was that 32% of bank customers shut down their bank account before the one year anniversary of having opening a bank account, and half of those 16% do it in the first hundred days. Now, Chris I found this staggering because I don’t know if you’ve opened a bank account recently, it’s a pain in that I think word I’m looking for his neck. It’s miserable. Yeah, I mean, there’s paperwork you have to go in in person, you have to show them an ID, you have to bring multiple forms of identification, you have to get your new ATM card, you have to pick a pin number for that you have to get checks printed, if you’re old school like me, you potentially get sold into some other stuff they want to do, you have to set up your online banking, you have to set up your direct deposit, you got to bring the money from your old bank into the new bank, you got to make sure that there’s nothing still clearing in the old bank before you bring the last dollars over. Oh, my goodness, I’m exhausted just describing all the things you have to do, let alone actually doing them. And yet, despite that 16% of new bank company, customers shut their account their brand new account that they just opened before the 100 day anniversary. I found that number staggering, because if there’s a group of people in our society that I like to think pay attention to the bottom line in numbers, it’s bankers. And so it’s like, oh, my God, if it’s this bad with bankers, what’s it like in the rest of the world, and I went on a hunt. And I started looking. And that’s where I realized that across all industries, it’s 20 to 70%, restaurants hovered about 50 to 60%. auto mechanics is 68%, cell phones is 32%. These numbers were just incredible. And as I was doing all of this, two other things were happening. Number one, I was running an ad agency where my job was to drive as many new people to the door for my various clients. And we were really making the phones ring, we were getting the leads. But when I would go back to them three months later, six months later, their business hadn’t grown to the same degree it should have because they got them in the door, but they didn’t keep them. And it wasn’t that we were getting the wrong leads, it’s that they didn’t have a system and a process for delivering a remarkable experience for them. Last piece of the puzzle when I was in undergraduate, one of the areas of focus, I was a government major, one of the things I focused a lot on was the United States presidency. And most people when they hear the concept, the first hundred days are drawn to that phrase that is often used in the first hundred days of the presidency. What is how successful were you in the first hundred days, it’s a reference to Roosevelt. Um, when all of these things combined, that I realized I had this understanding of a presidents for years and term are evaluated by their first hundred days of behavior. 16% of banking customers are leaving in the first hundred days 20 to 70% of all customers across all industries are leaving in the first hundred days, this thought came together of what would happen if we never lose if we never lost a customer again, what would happen and and what’s fascinating briefly, if I may, about the title is when I presented it to the publisher. They wanted never lose a customer. And I said, No, we need to say again. And they’re like, what, why? Why is one word matter? I said, because when I say when I say never lose a customer with all due respect to the world you do in online marketing, I immediately think of all the ridiculous internet snake oil salesmen who are like, I’m going to teach you to never lose a customer. And it’s like, no, you’re not because that’s impossible. You’re going to lose some. I want to lose the ones that I want to lose. And when I say Never Lose a Customer Again, for me, that catapults my mind back to the one that got away. And I wish I didn’t get away.

Chris Dreyer

Wow. Yeah, one word.

Joey Coleman

Yeah, that genesis of how we came to Never Lose a Customer Again.

Chris Dreyer

I so you lead me to a question that basically a story and a question here. So I recently heard well, recently, I was about a year now heard you speak Jason Swenk’s, Digital Agency Retreat. Yes. And there was one story you had that really stood out. And I thought it was both humorous, but also, it really made me think that this is how many law firms are designed. And it was the story of dating marriage, and the meet faab concept and wondering if you could kind of elaborate on that.

Joey Coleman

Yeah, absolutely. No, and I appreciate that, Chris, um, you know, it’s interesting. I liken a lot of this stuff to dating. Okay, because when in doubt of what to do in our business life, just default to you what you know, is right to do in a dating scenario, and nine times out of 10 you get the right answer. So let’s pretend we’re in a dating scenario, right? You meet someone across a crowded room you saw on Tron over you strike up a conversation, one thing leads to another names are exchanged phone numbers are exchanged, or if you’re a youngster, you know, Insta handles, whatever it is. And next thing you know, you’re thinking, let’s go on a date. So you reach out and you schedule the first date. You go to the first date, it’s absolutely fantastic. The conversation is flowing while you’re on the first date. You’re asking for the second date. They say yes, you go to the second date. Dates amazing. You go to a show, you go to a movie, you go to a concert, things are jelling, everything’s good, you get to meet the friends over time the friends approve of you, the relationship is deepening. you’re figuring out your hopes, fears and dreams together, you get to meet the parents, the parents sign off on you, oh, everything’s amazing. This is the one you’re feeling good. And suddenly, you’re down on one nice thing, I’m all in, I want to be in relationship with you. And to our surprise and delight, the other person says, I want to be in relationship with you, too. So we throw a big kickoff call, I mean, wedding reception, we get everybody together to celebrate this beginning of the relationship. And then after that celebration, we grab the hand of our beloved, and we lead them to the honeymoon suite, we throw open the door, and we say, Honey, I’d like to introduce you to Bob, Bob’s your account representative, he’s going to be take caring, taking care of this relationship from now on, I need to go find someone else to get into a relationship with. If we did that, in our personal lives, we’d get slapped or worse. And yet, that’s how most businesses operate. The person who does all the courting, who does all the vetting, who gets approved by the friends and the family and the loved ones who hears our hopes, who hears our dreams. And then once we say I’m all in, hands us off to the junior associate who’s going to manage our case going forward, hands us off to the paralegal who’s going to do the intake and get all the documentation, hands us off to someone else in the firm, who’s going to be responsible for helping us envision our dream and get our hopes. Is it any wonder that our clients don’t feel appreciated? They don’t feel cared for? Because they thought they were marrying us. And they were really marrying the other people in our firm that they never had the chance to meet before they signed on the dotted line.

Chris Dreyer

Yeah, I wanted to bring up the story because it it, it just makes you think it’s how the world and for many businesses how they operate. And those that do it right, if they really stand out, where the introduction is where they start to Meet Bob a little earlier. Right? So they’re getting the sign up.

Joey Coleman

Yeah, Chris, you bring up an excellent, I’m not opposed to you having a bob in your firm. I’m opposed to your client meeting Bob, after they’ve signed on the dotted line. They should meet Bob during the courting, or at the very least, you should be talking Bob up like crazy during the courting so they know what to expect. And letting him know why Bob is going to be better served to take care of them than the person who’s doing the selling. I mean, let’s be candid, I’ve been in enough law firms. And I’m sure you have as well to know that the rainmaking senior partner is often not the one you want writing the briefs. They are often not the one you want making the closing argument to the jury. And they are almost certainly not the one you want negotiating with the insurance company. The reason they’re the Rainmaker and the salesperson is because they’re the Rainmaker and the salesperson, those are not the same skill set, necessarily, when it comes to writing briefs, arguing in front of juries or negotiating with insurance companies. Now, I’m not saying it can’t be the same person. But often it’s not. And if we just think a little bit more strategically about the timing of the client journey, and when we introduce them, to the individual players who are going to be helping on their case, and where the client is emotionally in that journey, and we meet them where they’re at. That’s how you deliver remarkable experience.

Chris Dreyer

So let’s talk about the tactical, the tactical, let’s talk about, you know, you have this whole journey, where we’re talking, I believe there’s eight A’s, the assess all the way to add advocacy. If you were going to give one nugget or one or two nuggets of where an attorney listening to this or like, yeah, this sounds great, but what the heck do I do? What are a couple things that they can do to improve the client experience for their prospects or any stage?

Joey Coleman

Yeah, so as a brief overview, I believe there are eight phases to the customer journey or the client journey. They all start with the letter A The theory is if you get them all right, it’s like your clients are giving you straight A’s. They love the experience they’re having you right, we start with the assess phase, where prospective client is deciding whether or not they want to work with you. Then we move to phase two, the admit phase, where the prospect admits that they have a problem or a need that they believe you can help them with. They sign on the dotted line, they enter into a retainer agreement. They then walk out of your office or they hang up the call and they enter the affirm stage, the buyer’s remorse stage where they begin to doubt the decision they just made. Almost everybody listening and watching with us today is heard of buyer’s remorse. But if I were to ask do you have a system and process in your practice to address that The buyer’s remorse that we scientifically know your clients are feeling. Most lawyers would get a little sheepish because they know they don’t. We then move to phase four, the Activate phase, this is the first real moment of truth that once they become a client, we start to show what we’re worth. This could be the first deposition, this could be the first intake call, this could be the first appearance in court, it really depends on the type of client and the type of representation. But this is where they get to see you in action for the first time. In the Activate phase, we want to energize the relationship, we want to let them know that doing business with us is going to be unlike any experience they’ve ever had. They then come to phase five, the acclimate phase, where they get used to our way of doing business. See, as a lawyer, you’ve done hundreds of cases, thousands of cases, maybe 10s of thousands of cases. But to the typical person, personal injury client or any client in any legal matter. It’s the first time they’ve ever had a lawyer, they have no idea what to expect. They didn’t spend three years in law school learning about filing deadlines, they didn’t spend time doing practice depositions, they have no idea what’s going on. And they have no idea what’s coming next, our job is to hold their hand and help them acclimate so that they get to phase six, the accomplish phase, when they achieve the goal they had when we originally they originally decided to hire us. If we do that, we move to phase seven, they become an adopter, where they’re loyal to us and only us they’re never going to work with another firm again. And last but not least the last phase phase eight, an advocate where they become a raving fans singing our praises far and wide. So that’s a fire hose overview of the eight phases that we spent 340 pages and 46 case studies describing in the book, but that gives you an idea of the arc. So your question, Chris, is what tactically What does someone do? I think there are two particular phases that all businesses and lawyers in particular struggle with the most. The first one is the affirm phase, that buyer’s remorse we talked about how do you solve that? You just make it really clear to the client, that they made a good decision, and that you’re excited to work with them. As a lawyer, I’d ask Have you ever written a client a thank you note for becoming the client? Probably not. Why? Well, that’s not really professional or Joe, you don’t understand I have too many clients are Why would I write a thank you note at the beginning where they just signed a retainer agreement? I’m on a contingency fee. This may not even work out for me. No, have you thanked them for taking a chance on you and for choosing you to represent them. And you thank them for their time for their attention for their focus for their Trump’s think about how you change the relationship. If you did that, as your first official communication with them, as opposed to the first official communication being a request for their medical records. Then we go to the acclimate phase. This is once things are up and running. Here’s the thing. I didn’t understand this. When I was a lawyer, I’m embarrassed to say I didn’t understand it, Chris. And then about 12, 15 years ago, about 12 years ago now we’re coming up on 15 minutes dad was in a career ending car accident, is a very successful trial attorney represented folks all over the country. And he was driving to court and a semi turned in front of him didn’t signal he went under the semi severe brain injury totaled car ended his career as one of the lawyers in the family and as the oldest I became the family’s representative to the lawyers as we navigated through his personal injury claim. And with all due respect to the lawyers who represented him, I for the first time saw what it was like to be a client. And here’s the problem. clients don’t know what’s coming next. They don’t know the work that we’re doing behind the scenes, the best insight they get into the work we’re doing behind the scenes is a bill. And if you’re on a retainer, lots of times they don’t even see the running tally. They have no idea how the case is going. They have no idea what conversations are happening with insurance companies, they have no idea where they are in negotiations, they’re being asked to pull medical records and chase them down. They’re being asked to prep and show up for depositions. It is an exhausting life sucking activity. And they’re not even sure when it’s going to end. There’s a huge opportunity for lawyers to communicate more with their clients, even if the communication is just Hey, we haven’t been able to get on a phone call in the last 30 days. But I want you to know I haven’t forgotten you. Here’s three things that have happened in the last 30 days. We’re making progress. You keep focusing on getting Better and unhealing. I’ll keep focusing on your lawsuit. If you need anything, call me.

Chris Dreyer

It seems simple.

Joey Coleman

And it seems easy. And yet we don’t do it. As a general rules, lawyers, as a general rule, lawyers don’t do it. And I’m not just being critical of lawyers because we could apply this analysis to any industry on the planet. And the same things hold true. We know more about our system and our process and the timelines than our clients ever will. And yet, we don’t do enough to explain that to them. And we don’t keep explaining it to them as they work through the church.

Chris Dreyer

I think it also kind of narrows in on some of us as business owners get upset, because and they don’t take accountability because they didn’t set expectations. They’re like, Oh, this customer is crazy. They’re they’re, they’re, they’re too much. They’re, they’re hitting me with too many emails and communication. But if it would have done that, on the front end, they had had a lot better experience, and they may not have turned into that bad client.

Joey Coleman

Yeah, you in my experience, the only time I got upset as a lawyer was when a client was calling. And they’re like, Hey, what’s the status of my case? What’s going on? Where things and I would get upset that they were bugging me? Let’s stop and think about that. whose job is it to keep them posted as to where things are mine? We don’t even have to get into the ethical discussions about the responsibility to do that we can just get into it stay at the practical tactical relevance of why have you decided to take on so many clients, that you can’t keep your existing clients informed of the status of their case? Have you become so intoxicated by the growth of your practice, by the desire to acquire and build and have bigger cases with more people with higher vertix? Did they become numbers to you?

Joey Coleman

That is that what you promised, when you signed the retainer agreement? You’ll be one of many. Where did you say, we’re going to take care of you? It’s terrible that you were injured. I’m so sorry that it happened. I know you’re physically in pain. I know you’re emotionally in pain. But don’t worry, I’m here for you. It’s okay. Now.

Chris Dreyer

I love that. And I think that would just make them more secure. they would they would that buyers or more would be gone. Also, I think the thing that you said the Lost Art of writing the handwritten Thank you where you can hold on to it as almost like an artifact to where they it makes them feel good. And they can revisit it as opposed to just saying something verbally. And there’s a love If I may forgive me for interrupting. I love that you called it an artifact because that’s what I think of it is as well.

Joey Coleman

I’d ask everybody listening, we’ll do a quick little game here. I want you to think, have you received a handwritten thank you note in the last year? Just think, have you received a handwritten thank you note in the last year? And I see you nodding your head. Chris, I’m nodding my head. I imagine many of your listeners and viewers are nodding their heads as well. Great. Second question. Do you still have it? You’re nodding your head. I’m nodding my head. I imagine that people listening and watching are nodding their heads to ask yourself this question Why? You read the thank you note. You know who it was from? If I asked you right now, who was the thank you note from what did it say? You read it you remember who was from? And yet you kept it? Did you keep it so that you could read it again, in case you forgot? Maybe. But I think the main reason you kept it is because here today in our present world, we are dying for tangible proof that we matter. We are dying for physical evidence that someone appreciates the role we play in their life. That’s why we keep thank you notes. We don’t keep them to reread them. We don’t keep them to remember who sent them. We keep them because we have a moment an artifact that shows we touched another human and we contributed to their life. If your listeners and viewers did nothing other than start writing thank you notes to their clients. It will dramatically change your practice as far as a singular tactic for our conversation that will move the dial more than any other thing. Writing thank you notes because it will move the dial in two ways. Not only will it move the dial for the clients experience, but it will move the dial for your experience because when’s the last time in this digital world that you sat down with a note card and a pen and wrote out longhand? what you thought about someone what you felt about them the contribution they made to their friends Practice how honored you were that they trusted you with their representation. We can get it into our bodies kinesthetically. A lot easier when we write a handwritten thank you note than when we can when we’re doing this typing on a keyboard, or we’re doing this talking on a phone, or we’re doing this looking at someone on a zoom call and saying what we think. And then as soon as this call is over, we’re on to the next call. And what was said, floats into the ether not to be remembered anytime soon.

Chris Dreyer

Right, exactly what you said you stand out, because you’ve got something as opposed to receiving that thousand email. What one of the things that I want to bring up is you’re you’re launching a group coaching program for lawyers to help them with this first hundred day experience. tell tell our audience a little bit about that.

Joey Coleman

Yeah, it’s interesting, because, you know, the, when I was a lawyer, people always make lawyer jokes, right? Um, and the phrase that a lot of people talk about, when lawyers, when they refer to lawyers is that wonderful line from Shakespeare First thing first, kill all the lawyers. The reality is most people don’t know where that line comes in the play. There’s a discussion being talked about, at the time about what do we do to destroy society. And one of the characters in the place as well, the first thing is you kill all the lawyers. Because the lawyers are responsible for justice, the lawyers are responsible for order, the lawyers are responsible for making sure that good things happen, and that the right things happen and that the just things happen. See, it’s been perverted in our society to mean that lawyers are bad, they’re evil, kill them first, like get rid of the lawyers in our life will be better. I disagree. I grew up the son of a lawyer, I was a practicing lawyer. For many years, I have many, many friends and classmates who are lawyers. I wanted to start this program because I think lawyers have a bad rap. And I think part of the reason they have a bad rap is because they are so busy looking lawyers that they forget to be human. They are so busy trying cases, that they forget the trying scenarios that their clients are going through. They’re so busy focusing on verdicts and victories, that they’re missing the opportunity to focus on injuries and healing that their clients are going through. So what I’ve done is I put together a program where we’re going to do it’s basically a live coaching course program, where we’ll walk you through the eight phases, you’ll map out your client journey as we go, we’ll do it as a group so that you get to learn from a bunch of other lawyers. And then if you like what you’ve seen, and you’ve gotten great value, we’re also launching a membership that will not only be lawyers, but will be people from all industries. Because if there’s one thing I’ve learned in almost 20 years of doing this, Chris is the same problem exists in every industry. We have humans for customers, I don’t care what business you’re in your customers, your clients, your members, whatever phrase you use to describe them. They’re people, they’re humans. So there’s a common thread of humanity, that we can learn from other industries and being bring best practices from those industries into the legal world, to make our experiences better, to make the experiences we’re creating for our clients better. So we’re going to be starting that up. And I’m super excited, because I feel like it’s a way for me to continue to connect with the legal profession, which I really enjoyed, and to hopefully raise the bar on client experience.

Chris Dreyer

I couldn’t agree more. And I think anyone that’s listening should definitely check that out. And also also read your book. And Joey, one final question here. Is there anything that you want to talk about that we haven’t discussed?

Joey Coleman

You know, it’s, it’s interesting, and I’ve loved our conversation, and I so appreciate the opportunity to spend some time with you and with your your listeners and your viewers. Um, I’d like to talk about the concept of an elite personal injury lawyer. Really, respectfully. I think the problem is we’re spending too much time focused first on the word lawyer, and second on the word elite, and not enough time focusing on the words personal injury. If you are what society refers to as an ambulance chaser, somebody who’s just fighting insurance companies trying to get money for coffee that was too hot, you know, and you know, complainer’s, you’re going to get sucked into the lawyer side of that. If instead you’re looking at someone who’s Life was very different before the proximate cause of this accident happened, whose vision of their future was very different before this external force inserted itself into their life, unbeknownst to them and wreak havoc. If we’re not focusing on the injury, and we’re not focusing on the personal nature of that injury, and our opportunity to personally connect to the client and provide a personal service you actually don’t get to call yourself elite in my book.

Chris Dreyer

I couldn’t agree more. Guys, we’ve been talking to Joey Coleman best selling author of Never Lose a Customer Again, Joey, where can people go to learn more?

Joey Coleman

All the best place to find me is on my website. It’s JoeyColeman.com JOEY. Like a five year old or a baby kangaroo, you know,Joey Coleman co l e ma n like the camping equipment. Joey Coleman.com there, you’ll find videos, you’ll find a first hundred days implementation kit that you can download. You’ll find links to my podcast, which is called Experience This!, which is all about how to create remarkable experiences and little bite size morsels of customer experience and client experience delight. You’ll find links to my book, Never Lose a Customer Again, which you can get in bookstores, we have it as a hardback as an ebook and audiobook that I actually narrate. So if you’ve enjoyed listening to me talk, you can listen to me read the book. And if you actually go to Joeycoleman.com/lawyers, and it’s lawyers plural, because there’s a lot of you listening. What I’m going to put together, Chris is a first hundred days implementation guide that gives an overview of the eight phases of the client journey and how you can apply these six tools that is specific for lawyers. So that you can have an idea of how to actually implement this includes some worksheets that you’ll be able to do with the other associates or paralegals or people in your firm. So you can self map this if you want to. There will also be some information that if you’re interested can direct you towards what it might be like to get involved in our online programs or our memberships.

Chris Dreyer

Get I think everyone should check that out, guys, and we’ll link that up in the show notes. Joey, thanks so much for coming on the show.

Joey Coleman

Chris. My pleasure. Thanks for having me. And thanks to everybody for giving us your time to listen in. Chris always brings great guests, and I hope you all had as much fun listening as I did being interviewed by Chris.

Conclusion

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